Pedro Entertains, But Can He Pitch?

pedro signs.jpgI’ve attended countless news conferences over the years.

Today’s easily was the most entertaining.

“I bring with me a legacy,” Pedro Martinez said. “I bring with me, my last name. I bring my face. I bring everything I have, my integrity, to this team.

“I might surprise you. I might not. But it’s going to be fun. It’s going to be really fun to go out and find out.”

The Phillies officially announced at Citizens Bank Park they had signed Martinez, 37, to a one-year contract worth $1 million, plus roughly $1.5 million in incentives. The Phillies immediately placed him on the 15-day disabled list with what they termed a mild strain in his right shoulder. That move is procedural because he is not ready to pitch in the Majors. He will join the Phillies this weekend in Florida for evaluation before he begins his rehabilitation assignment in Clearwater, Fla.

Phillies general manager Ruben Amaro Jr. said Martinez could be pitching for the Phillies as early as July 30, when the Phillies open a four-game series against the Giants in San Francisco.


Asked about Phillies fans, Martinez said, “As far as embracing the Phillies fans, I think I’m going to have a lot of fun because they seem to be really wild. And I’m a little bit out there, too. I think we’re going to match up really well.”


A couple things:

Reports the Phillies won’t pursue Roy Halladay because of his contract are inaccurate, according to folks I’ve talked to. Amaro even said today they still have flexibility this season to add salary. This trade comes down to one thing: prospects. Who do the Blue Jays want, and who are the Phillies willing to give up?

Forget about Vernon Wells being packaged in a Halladay deal. That’s a deal breaker for the Phillies, and just about everybody else, too.


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I am completely on board with this signing. Ultimate low-risk-high-reward move. Pedro is out to prove last year was a fluke which I really believe it was. Now is he going to channel the Pedro from his prime, I doubt it. But is he going to be as awful as he was last year where he had many variables adding to his poor performance? I certainly don’t think so. The guy is a competitor and he lives for the spotlight. He has now been thrust into the city with the defending world champions after seemingly every other team passed on him. I smell a steal.

Not liking that the Phils gave him Tugger’s number!

Joed: yuo are right in that Pedro may surprise us and be a decent #5 starter for us for teh next 2-3 months. My problem with the signing is tht we need a right hand bat off the bench more then a #5 pitcher who will not do any better then teh #5’s we’ve used so far this season since Myers went down. A million would have got us a pretty good hitter for the rest of the season

hopefully he’ll pitch as well as the Tugger

hopefully he’ll pitch as well as the Tugger

f_i_j: I agree that they need a bench bat desperately. But they don’t need to act right now on that. They might as well wait until after the 31st and pick one up off the scrap heap. Or they could go to the local wawa and finally someone of a similar skill level to Bruntlett to hold them over until the deadline passes.

I started thinking……What does a year’s contract mean? Just the rest of this season? Or a full 12 months? If it’s a full 12 months, we may be in this exact same position a year from now. But I guess I’m getting ahead of myself.

I would like to know what the incentives are. I don’t see those details coming out but it would be interesting to know.

f_i_j: There will be bats out there after the 31st. And trust me, they’ll be better than Bruntlett and more experienced at pinch hitting than Mayberry. Mayberry still has some raw tools but contact is key off the bench and that is his weakest aspect. Bruntlett is nothing more than a waste of space. I really feel like you can find a suitable veteran (ala Jeff Conine of the past) to help this team out in the righty bench bat department.

norma, Pedro’s contract is for this season only. I don’t know what the incentives are to get the extra 1.5 million, but I would think it is tied into starts and innings pitched. If he gets a bunch of starts and is nothing but a 5 inning pitcher, I doubt he’ll get any incentives.

it means for this season only. And we don’t need a RHB off teh “scrap heap” but a decent bat who can make contact (not a HR hitter per say) and knows the game. No difference now or after July 31 except that now the player doesn’t need to clear waivers first. Teams aren’t more likely to cut/release anyone after trade deadline, so date is moot. Mayberry is not the answer (Brunlett is a glove off the bench, not a bat)

So the possible domino effects this signing creates are as follows in my eyes:

1. They can now flip Happ + prospects for Halladay if the price is right.

2. They may be in the market for a pen arm because of Petey’s inability to go deep into games. The pen has really been pushed so far this year. Adding another elderly arm might break it.

Norma: I thought the same thing about the # they gave Pedro II (I think that’s what we should call him as to not confuse him with Pedro Feliz – Pedro I) I’m surprised that the Phils haven’t retired it.

I think there is a rule that if you ever wore a Mutt’s uniform you can’t have your # retired

Phan, I agree however, the contribution he made in 1980 should get him special status. Without him, just like without Lidge last year, we dont’ win that WS.

WTF it’s screwing up the order of posts–AGAIN. Todd, tell to get their act together and higher a decent tech guy finally

Not to knock him, but Tug wasn”t here long enough nor did he contribute to a level to get his number retired. I guess it’s easy to want to enshrine everybody from one of our only two World F’ing Championshsips, but it is unrealistic.

I agree, Phan, but like Lidge last year, we don’t win the WS without Tugger. He deserves special consideration for that

Thanks for the clarification of Pedro II’s contract. (I like that, Karen!). I figured it meant the season. Whew!

As for Tugger’s number…..I’m not necessarily suggesting it should be retired. But that’s no reason to give it to someone else. Especially a player who’s not proven, and may only be here for the short term. Just saying.

Seeing that picture 10 years ago would have caused me to do a back flip.

If they haven’t retired number 10, they shouldn’t retire 45. I think Pedro might be at least the second guy to wear it recently. Memory fails, but I think somebody else had it before.
Remember, that Tug was on the DL until June in 1980.
I’m amused by all this Halladay talk. The Phils think they have 10 future Hall of Famers in their farm system. I’d bet a month’s pay they don’t get a sniff at Halladay this year. Meanwhile, it’s making good fodder for talk radio and stuff like this.
Trade the prospects. They’re prospects, that’s the point. How many outfielders do they need? Halladay is a known quantity, and all of you (including me) who talk about these minor leaguers have never seen them play.
Trade them and draft some more. That’s the point of the minor leagues, to help the big club, whether it’s trading them or filling holes. Right now, the Phils only have one hole – at pitcher.

Signing Pedro can’t hurt and MIGHT help.

Halliday would be a nice acquisition BUT ONLY at the right trading price. The phils will likely win the NL east without him this year anyway and they have already won the WS WITHOUT him. The decision to trade for Halliday has to be based on value and balancing the needs of the present with the needs of 2010. Fans need to be objective and take the big name ego issue out of it. I know of people who have seen Drabek pitch and Michael Taylor play the OF. They are both studs who could PLAY right NOW for a lot of ML teams. And Happ has been the best starting pitcher the Phils have , since he’s been put into the rotation. I would NOT trade Drabek, Happ or Taylor. Anybody else in the farm sysem, I’d put into the package. If the Jays want more than that , Cya.

I believe that Terry Mullholland also wore #45.

FYI: After watching the press conference w/Pedro II and seeing footage of him w/the Bosox & Mutts, he’s always worn #45 so he probably wanted to continue to wear it.

I think it was Mullholland. And I DID get to see Terry pitch a no-hitter. Think Pedro II is capable of that?

Still think he could be a bad character in the clubhouse and affect others…. more concerns….
1- His legacy isn’t out there pitching
2- Going by the blogs, his name and face don’t mount to much and there not pitching
3- Integrity… was that a joke
4- Pitched a couple of simulations and is on the DL with sore shoulder, thats a good sign of things to come
5- Who wouldn’t take 1 mill to see how it goes with a job
6- If he sucks be sure the fans will let him know from the first inning, he hasn’t earned any rights in Philly yet

You don’t win over 200 games and have a sub 3 ERA by sheer luck. I’ll take Pedro on reputation alone over a middle reliever turned starter in Bastardo anyday. I don’t understand how anyone can be mad about this signing. And he will not be a bad character in the clubhouse. He plays every fifth day and this team already has established leaders in the clubhouse. This isn’t the Mets where they need to post pictures of a scuffle in the hallway to try to motivate themselves.

And muleman:
I personally don’t think the Blue Jays are that serious about dealing Halladay. I don’t think he will be moved at all. But as far as draft picks go, if Halladay were to come here then walk after 2010 the Phillies would get 2 first round picks. That would definitely help replenish the farm system.

The Jays have to be serrious about Halalday. He’s a FA after next year and very few teams will do what the Brewers did last year and sell the farm to rent a player for half a season. The Jays need to rebuild. They are in baseball’s toughest division and compete against two teams (yanks and Boston) who together can outspend the rest of the Majors combined. Since they are a small market team, they need a crop of young players who are totally controlled by the team or just starting the arbitrati0n process who can be the core of a team, much like what teh phillies did with Howard, Ultey, Rollins, Cole and Pat. The only question is are we willing to pay the price tehy want, and is anyone else willing or able to match or beat it.

Joed21, anything is possible with this guy, so maybe he will turn out to be the 5th place saviour… however 200 games most of which was done before 2006, and I thought we were using Lopez not Bastardo, it’s not the scuffles in the clubhouse, cause I think he would be hard pushed to scuffle with anyone on the Philly roster, it’s more the if I dont get the chance to get my bonus’, maybe I’ll do what i want on the mound, type attitude, Philly is a team not a bunch of individualist thrown together and hope something good comes out… There is no question Martinez had the stuff to be an individualist, the question is, is he goning to be any better than Lopez or not and you cant assume anything based on past performance, otherwise Jamie would not be in the rotation. I guess it’s lets see what happens, the problem is that is his attitude too and for a Mill why not I guess…

devil, the only reason Pedro is on the DL is so he can get innings in the minors and get ready to pitch by the end of the month. He’s not hurt. The investment is well worth it; low risk, possibly high reward. I am assuming that his incentives are based on quality starts and innings pitched, so it’s pretty much up to him to make more money. The Phillies wil give him the starts and he has to go deep into games to accumulate innings. I doubt any incentives have anything to do with wins and losses, as a pitcher can always have a great outing and still lose.

I’m tired of talking about Halladay. I think they need to give up something substantial for maybe the best pitcher in MLB. Nobody can argue that he makes them a better team over the next year and a half, and isn’t that what it’s all about? They would become prohibitive favorites to win the NL, and make them much more competitive in the WS. But I don’t think Amaro can pull the trigger. Gillick would have already done it.

I think that in order to get Halalday we’ll need to offer the folowing:

I’m not sure I’d do it, but I think that’s the kind of “Blow me away” package Toronto is looking for.

Here’s a question no one is asking…..if they don’t get Halladay, who’s out there that might be a in the next tier below that the Phils could acquire. Earlier of course everyone talked about Peavy, Marquis, etc. Wondering who’s available?

Lee can be had probably and Duke from the Bucs should be available (pittsburgh will trade anyone it seems)

Peavy is hurt and he has indicated numerous times that he won’t give up his no-trade to play on the east coast. I wouldn’t want him because, even if he OK’d it, it would be reluctantly. They could try to talk to Ed Wade about Oswalt, because he is the next best thing to Halladay. I wouldn’t give up quite as much to get him, but he is a solid ML pitcher and would immmediately be our #1. 200+ inning pitcher who throws strikes. Cliff Lee may be available, but I would give up far less for him. Not as consistent as Halladay and Oswalt, and I think he would be a half year rental.

If nothing happens I would look into the health of Brandon Webb in the offseason. He will be a free agent and he would thrive in CBP.

I actually would get Duke. We should be able to get him for Mayberry or Donald + low level pitching prospect. He seems to be breaking out this year, and would be a blanton type pickup

I really don’t see Pedro going out there and trying to fail just for the fun of it. And I realize that Lopez is the current #5 but he is also banged up. And you can’t tell me with a straight face that you would rather have Lopez on the mound than Pedro.

As far as the prospect package for Halladay goes, it seems to be steep. I really would not want to give up Happ, Drabek and Taylor all in one deal. I’ll give you 2 of the 3 plus 2 other mid-level prospects but they can’t get all 3. That’s potentially highway robbery. But really how many arms do the Jays want? Don’t they have some guys who are going to be on the rebound next year like Litsch, Marcum and the rest of their wounded staff. If they pulled both Happ and Drabek I don’t see how they couldn’t be happy with that.

I don’t understand why some people are making snide comments about pedro martinez wearing Tugger’s old number, 45. There’s been at least a few other Phillies that wore #45, since Tug. Off the top of my head, I know Terry Mulholland & Tom Gordon wore it, as well as current bench coach, Pete Mackanin, until Pedro asked for it. If a number isn’t retired by a team, it’s fair game, regardless of any emotions that may be attached to it.

Gordon was the guy I was trying to think of in my earlier comment. I think there’s too much sentimentality attached to uniform numbers. The imporant name on the uniform is the one on the front.

f.i.j.: Why wouldn’t you give up guys who’ve never played in the majors for someone you KNOW can play? Happ? Remember Tyler Green and Marty Bystrom? That’s J.A. Happ. The rest of them are fruit. You pick them when they’re ripe and the tree will grow more. Guys like Halladay come along once a decade. When it happens, you grab them.

Muleman, I didn’t say I wouldn’t give them up, I said I wasn’t sure. First of all, I think Happ is more of a Dick Reuven then a Marty Bystrom. He is no Kendrick who did’t have much stuff, but managed to win by getting great run support. He’s a legit #3 pitcher. The other guys are projected (yes, I know its a crap shoot) to be good and will fill in for players we will loose after 2011. What I can’t decide is am I willing to be content with WS wins in 2009 and 2010 and then suffer again like we did in the mid-late ’90s, or do I want to have a good chance of winning this year and next and a team that will be very competitive, or at least potentially competitive for years after. It’s not easy to decide to gut your team in the future for the chance to win it all for two more years. Please remember, we loose Howard, Rollins, Werth, Victorino, Feliz, Ibanez, Hamels, Lidge, Madson, Romero after 2010 or 2011. We need to replace them from somewhere and our team is the Phillies, not the Yankees who can buy whomever they want

The reason Amaro won’t “pull the trigger” is that the Phillies owners are greedy. Their highest aim is not one or two more WS championships. Amaro has practically said as much. Because they are afraid that if they lose their best farm players the Phillies are gonna stink again within 5 years and they’ll lose many fans and revenue. So they would rather play it down the middle more like the Eagles and “be decent” for 10 years and hope they can win 1 or 2 more championships without taking too many risks. Keep the fan base hungry. But don’t they see that if we win one or 2 more championships with Halladay, many of us fans (old and new) will stay loyal forever!?! (Not to mention that the ballpark is a draw in and of itself, regardless of the team’s success). Especially if we know they took a reasonable risk like getting Halladay. PLEASE LISTEN TO US AMARO AND THE PHILLIES OWNERS! WE WANT HALLADAY!

jefzahav: 2011? If you’re going to keep those guys in the minors for 2 more years, you’re making my case for trading them for Halladay.
In two years they’ll have more guys who are “can’t miss” prospects just like the guys they have now. That’s the point of a minor league system. Players on every team get old, so that can’t be the point.

Muleman: It takes more tehn 2 years to move through the system. We’re talking about Brown who is in A ball and projected to be ready either for 2011 or 2012. taylor is supposed to be ready either late next year or 2011, he’s in AA. The only players we have in the minors who are ready next year (not counting pitchers) are Donalds, and Marson (both of whom would be bench players for the phils if not traded. The release of Coste seems to signify that Marson is the backup C next year if not included in a trade. Donald would replace Brunlett.

I wasn’t even thinking of age, but of the player’s contract status.

Phillsbabe: you can say many things about this team, but cheap isn’t one of them. They proved that by eating Eaton’s and Jenkin’s contracts in order to put the best team possible on the field this year. The questino everyone, including the front office, if asking is do we go for broke now, knowing it may cost us the chance to be competitive after 2011 for a few years, or keep the status quo and be competitive for more years, but with lesss chance of winning it all

If Donald is just going to be a replacement for Bruntlett then no one should have any issues with moving him in a trade. I was on the Donald bandwagon before spring training started but I’ve cooled off. I’m just not sure how good of a major leaguer he will be. Granted he had an injury this year but he was underwhelming even before landing on the DL. He is approaching 25 years old, which by many scouts accounts is make or break time for a prospect.

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